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1813Anschutz
Advanced Member
USA
2291 Posts |
 Posted - 06/24/2012 : 13:39:33
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| yoopertrave..so does that mean that we can now buy S&W's again? |
"The more I shoot,the LUCKIER I seem to get!" |
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YooperTrav
Average Member
USA
785 Posts |
Posted - 06/24/2012 : 14:28:26
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| Mine isnt right afterall. Its been back @ S&W for a week now. Im not buying another Smith until they make good on my Shield |
GOD BLESS AMERICA
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jeff hughes
New Member
67 Posts |
Posted - 06/24/2012 : 18:01:01
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Bummer. Held one today and really liked it.
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Razorback
New Member
USA
60 Posts |
Posted - 06/25/2012 : 01:59:38
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| I shoot as much as I can afford to and have only put a hundred rounds or so through my shield. Do any of you guys think this issue might fix itself after maybe 500-1000 rounds are ran through it and everything's broken in good? |
Springfield XD-40
M&P Shield 9mm
S&W 66 .357 mag |
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Buck
Senior Member
1041 Posts |
Posted - 06/25/2012 : 08:26:53
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This is weird you guys are having this problem. A friend of mine bought a Shield and we took it to the range and put over 100 rounds through it without a single failure.
He bought it because he wanted to replace his Kel-Tec which FTF, FTE every other round. He's VERY pleased with his Shield.
I sure hope S&W makes yours right! |
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Nathan
Big Sky Guy
USA
21540 Posts |
Posted - 06/25/2012 : 08:54:56
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quote:
Originally posted by Buck
A friend of mine bought a Shield and we took it to the range and put over 100 rounds through it without a single failure.
note this isnt a range failure. this is the type of failure you would have if you were trying to draw to shoot to defend yourself and bump your slide on the steering wheel....or if you drew from a coat pocket and the slide caught briefly on your fabric. this is they type of failure you wont find until you try pulling the trigger, and this is why its such a dangerous failure. |
Nathan In Montana, carrying a Gen4 Glock 19 loaded with Federal 147 grain +P JHPs carried in a Galco King Tuk thats worn on a Wilderness Instructor's belt.
NRA Certified Instructor, Rifle, Shotgun and Pistol
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GunNut
Average Member
USA
821 Posts |
Posted - 06/25/2012 : 11:48:28
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I've been following this with great interest, as I really like the looks of the Shield, and love my M&P40/.357C (once I replaced the slide-stop). Reading the details of all your experiences, it sounds almost like insufficient spring force to overcome some kind of extractor or breechface resistance.
On another note, several of you tested your M&P's for return-to-battery and disconnector function. My return-to-battery is infallible, as everybody has stated, but my empty gun will "fire" with the slide almost 1/8" back from battery. At this point, the barrel is just starting to unlock a little. This makes me a little concerned. How far can you'all's slide be back out of battery and still fire on your M&P's? And pls continue to update Smith's responses to this... Thx, |
An armed society is a polite society. |
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Nathan
Big Sky Guy
USA
21540 Posts |
Posted - 06/25/2012 : 11:52:41
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all of my M&Ps (except the shield) close just fine on their own. i just bought another M&P on saturday in fact. service in 357 sig with factory night sights for $550 at my local cabelas.
ive faith that S&W will eventually repair this issue. |
Nathan In Montana, carrying a Gen4 Glock 19 loaded with Federal 147 grain +P JHPs carried in a Galco King Tuk thats worn on a Wilderness Instructor's belt.
NRA Certified Instructor, Rifle, Shotgun and Pistol
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GunNut
Average Member
USA
821 Posts |
Posted - 06/25/2012 : 15:57:40
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10-4 on std M&P closing fine; I can't make it stick. I'm curious about the 1/8" out-of-battery being ok on the disconnector. Probably one of those things you never notice 'til you're obsessing over it. Gonna have to check the other semi-autos now :) 1813- you said your M&P's won't fire out of battery. Can you verify how much slide movement they do allow? Same 1/8" or so?
Also, I just noticed Yooper's gun fails to RTB unloaded, with 7 rounder, so I'm mistaken about extractor or breechface resistance. What exactly is providing the resistance unloaded? And that is a lot of brass rubbing if you ask me. Neither XD mags stuffed full when new nor the brutal when new M&P40C mags/springs do that... Also, curious why the 7 rounder is hard to seat- where's it's problem? Spring or dimensions maybe?...
I'm sure they'll fix it, now that it's becoming public knowledge via the power of the 'net. |
An armed society is a polite society. |
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redhotz28
New Member
USA
55 Posts |
Posted - 06/26/2012 : 18:37:12
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| Interesting... I haven't been able to find one of these to buy around here- maybe I lucked out? Anxiously awaiting S&Ws answer- this would be my primary carry piece. |
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gunslinger
Advanced Member
USA
2072 Posts |
Posted - 06/27/2012 : 11:05:15
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quote:
Originally posted by Nathan
quote:
Originally posted by jeff hughes
What is the current verdict on this weapon?
until i get it back and the problem is gone, this weapon is not suitable for carry. any failure that makes a defensive weapon fail to go bang when the trigger is pulled is unacceptable.
Good thing you have your new SIG C3 to carry. They go bang every time you pull the trigger.  |
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LCNM
Starting Member
USA
1 Posts |
Posted - 06/27/2012 : 11:27:11
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I got my 9mm Shield back in early May, I got my UBG holster in early June, and I've put over a thousand rounds down range practicing with the combo. I've also practiced pocket carrying the gun using a Desantis pocket holster. I have had zero problems and I felt really comfortable and secure carrying this gun.
Then, I stumbled across this post, and being the paranoid fellow I am, I checked out the out of battery using my gun. Yep, I could create the out of battery condition, so I started to worry, which is something my wife says I do better than anyone. What bothered me the most was that I did not discover this problem on my own and I realized how I could have been killed by not knowing about it.
Next, I started thinking. I figured out that I never encountered the out of battery problem because of my training and experience. First, I always holster my pistols by pushing on the back of the slide, never by the grip. As I recall, the reason for this training was to prevent an out of battery problem with pistols in general, but I am not positive about that because it was a long time ago. Second, I always use a holster when I pocket carry to make sure no accidents happen and that nothing can get tangled in my gun. Third, even after I forced my gun into the out of battery condition in my holster (using snap caps, not live ammo), I could not do a normal draw without putting the Shield back in battery. If I used extreame care, and slowly worked the gun out, I could sustain the out of battery, but I don't consider that to be a realistic situation.
Now, at least for the way I carry my guns, I am concerned that some potential "fix" might be worse than the out of battery "problem" is for me. I understand the spectrum of people who legally carry a gun, and that mix of people encompases a wide range of training and skill levels. So, do I see this out of battery issue to be a real problem? Yes, for some people it is, but not for everyone. If fixing the out of battery problem means swapping out my current recoil spring for one that is stiffer, or a modification that makes the gun thicker, or heavier, or alters the trigger or some other physical change that eliminates some part of the gun that makes it right for me, then I am not sure I want that repair. But, if the problem can be fixed without altering the ergonomics, performance, accuracy, or reliability of the gun, then I would be interested.
So, for now at least, I have stopped worrying but I will continue to monitor the responses. |
LCNM |
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YooperTrav
Average Member
USA
785 Posts |
Posted - 06/28/2012 : 15:43:06
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| Got my shield back today. Problem is the same. Going back for the THIRD time.... |
GOD BLESS AMERICA
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Nathan
Big Sky Guy
USA
21540 Posts |
Posted - 06/28/2012 : 17:22:04
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quote:
Originally posted by YooperTrav
Got my shield back today. Problem is the same. Going back for the THIRD time....
theres no excuse for this! |
Nathan In Montana, carrying a Gen4 Glock 19 loaded with Federal 147 grain +P JHPs carried in a Galco King Tuk thats worn on a Wilderness Instructor's belt.
NRA Certified Instructor, Rifle, Shotgun and Pistol
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Johnde
Average Member
USA
528 Posts |
Posted - 06/28/2012 : 18:33:35
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| I guess I can start looking at another gun. Your issue saved me enough to buy top of the line Michelins for the Highlander. |
Ohio 4-H Certified Pistol Instructor, dedicated to preparing our youth to excercise their Second Amendment rights.
CCW License Holder.
Law Abiding American Citizen.
NRA Life Member.
Self-professed Absolutist. |
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GunNut
Average Member
USA
821 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2012 : 14:04:21
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| There's no excuse for the robotic stupidity on Smith's part. Even if their plan is to claim this behavior is "normal", they need to actually communicate with their customer. This is a very personal business. Obviously, the weapon demonstrates the behavior noted (hopefully clearly); Why is there no answer (at all/) addressing the issue reported?! I would try to contact at least the director of customer service, if not the product manager. I'm still interested in knowing what exactly is rubbing, or hanging up, or causing the resistance... |
An armed society is a polite society. |
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bralko85
Junior Member
USA
343 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2012 : 14:23:02
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quote:
Originally posted by GunNut
There's no excuse for the robotic stupidity on Smith's part. Even if their plan is to claim this behavior is "normal", they need to actually communicate with their customer.
THE reason I no longer have any M&Ps. I got tired of Smith's responses to the white dot falling out of the front sight, the take down lever not staying put on disassembly, regularly misaligned factory sights, and the auto-forward problem they kept trying to pass off as a "feature".
If you can't assume responsibility for what are obvious and wide-spread problems, then address the shoddy QC, you don't get business. Sorry. |
"The difference between death and taxes is that death doesn't get worse every time Congress meets." |
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1813Anschutz
Advanced Member
USA
2291 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2012 : 16:53:19
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Any MY S&W experiences are VASTLY opposite of bralko85's.....I own 4 and the only one I have had a problem with is my Full Size .40 that had over 16,000 rounds downrange in USPSA/IDPA matches..was getting light striker hits on the primer. Called S&W on Tues. AM and they shipped a new striker assy. NO CHARGE and it arrived on Thursday. I changed it out and the gun is again flawless for another 16,000 rounds and about ten times that in dry fires.
All of my USPSA colleaques shooting an M&P LOVE the auto-forward feature that you are complaining about.
Take down lever not staying put on disassembly? I don't get it..Have had all of them apart MANY times and this was NEVER an issue. None of the herd had sights that were mis-aligned ( and even if they were it is no big deal to move them) and the white dot in the sights is still in all of them as well. If it were to come out a small dab of paint and we are good to go again.
In MY book Smith & Wesson Customer Service is second only to Dillon......
Randy |
"The more I shoot,the LUCKIER I seem to get!" |
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bralko85
Junior Member
USA
343 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2012 : 17:31:56
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I don't mind the auto forward. My FS9 did it if I made a point to cause it, my 40c never did no matter how hard I tried. What I didn't like was how Smith would call it a feature in an attempt to pacify people who did complain. It's not a feature if it only happens on some guns, for some people. A feature is something that is designed to work or function in a specific way, every time. And yes, I know this happens with other platforms, which isn't my point.
As far as the disassembly lever, this is something that developed for me on both pistols after some use. Neither of mine came home from the shop doing it. Large numbers of other M&P owners also experienced this, I might add. Similar threads are all over other forums.
Both front sight posts were misaligned when I bought my M&Ps, but I had NS to install so I didn't care. Again, very redundant discussions focus on this issue.
The white dot never popped out on either of mine, but this is also an INCREDIBLY common concern on other chat boards.
Regarding these four issues, if they all happened for all guns with all owners, we could chalk these up to design flaws of some form or another. Since some of these only happened for some people with some guns, I count it as shoddy QC.
To be fair, threads lauding Smith's CS are all over the web also. Pick your poision I guess.
- My apologies for derailing this thread. - |
"The difference between death and taxes is that death doesn't get worse every time Congress meets." |
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YooperTrav
Average Member
USA
785 Posts |
Posted - 07/08/2012 : 14:25:11
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| Nathan/Razorback any updates? |
GOD BLESS AMERICA
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GunNut
Average Member
USA
821 Posts |
Posted - 07/08/2012 : 16:08:20
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| "In MY book Smith & Wesson Customer Service is second only to Dillon......" I would agree, though I have seen some QC issues leave the factory that surprise me. Waiting to hear the response, and I hope you guys push it to the top if needed to at least get some answer. |
An armed society is a polite society. |
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modernswords
Junior Member
USA
428 Posts |
Posted - 07/08/2012 : 17:44:42
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This is very dissapointing for me. I am a S&W fanboi and have not been able to bring myself to buy an M&P due to what I feel are crappy triggers and high prices compared to competitive models. And now this...
I think I will stick with S&W revolvers and Gen 3s. |
 
"...he who has no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one."
“A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.”- Amendment II, U.S. Constitution |
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1813Anschutz
Advanced Member
USA
2291 Posts |
Posted - 07/08/2012 : 18:07:23
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M&P's just need to be dry fired a bunch and then in no time at all you have a very nice trigger. Cannot address pricing as here in Billings Montana I bought a full size .40 M&P in VERY nice condition for $300.00 as a back up to my main M&P that I use in USPSA and IDPA matches.
That one had over 16,000 rounds downrange and about 10X that before that striker assy. gave out. Called S&W on Tues. AM and they had a new one in my mailbox on Thursday. Gun is up and running flawlessly again.
This is the kind of Customer Service that S&W has routinely delivered for me..........
Get an M&P and enjoy the heck out of it!!! If the trigger is problematic for you get an M&P PRO. Just MY opinion...I have 4 of them
Randy |
"The more I shoot,the LUCKIER I seem to get!" |
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modernswords
Junior Member
USA
428 Posts |
Posted - 07/08/2012 : 18:43:11
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quote:
Originally posted by 1813Anschutz
I bought a full size .40 M&P in VERY nice condition for $300.00 as a back up to my main M&P that I use in USPSA and IDPA matches.
Randy
Thanks for the recommendation, Randy. I've shot a few new M&Ps and was not impressed. However, if I could run across a deal like you mention, I'd surely give the gun a chance! |
"...he who has no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one."
“A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.”- Amendment II, U.S. Constitution |
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Tye
Junior Member
403 Posts |
Posted - 07/08/2012 : 21:49:27
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I'm still looking for the right S&W to enter my collection -- I can't believe I don't have one, yet! Perhaps testiment to a wonderful selection in a variety of niches out there right now industry wide!
Just in case ya didn't know, Beretta has deviated from its decocker safety and external hammer with its newer striker fired NANO a less than 1" wide single stack 9mm (or allegedly .40). Fits the pocket. . . About $400... Anecdotedly doesn't have the same failure in this post has has not had issues shooting suitable self defense ammo or as I mentioned in another post ridiculously light weight ammo with limp wrists.
I really did try to refrain from hijacking this thread, but my Nano (or any other of my autos) don't have the same failure (I got rid of the Keltec PF-9 before this thread came up). I thank you very much, though, for shedding light on something very important to verify with a carry gun.
BR, |
Tye |
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Topic |
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M&P Shield - out of battery failure
