A video for those who think Glocks never fail

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Ohio9
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A video for those who think Glocks never fail

Postby Ohio9 » Tue May 05, 2015 12:38 pm

They can and do. In this case, an officer's glock failed him at a very bad time. Thankfully the threat was already down by then


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Re: A video for those who think Glocks never fail

Postby Nathan » Tue May 05, 2015 12:56 pm

The gun was out of battery before he fired it; how was this a Glock failure?
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Re: A video for those who think Glocks never fail

Postby Ohio9 » Tue May 05, 2015 1:02 pm

Nathan wrote:The gun was out of battery before he fired it; how was this a Glock failure?


What are you talking about? The video shows him firing a few shots and then suffering a stoppage. That is a failure.

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Re: A video for those who think Glocks never fail

Postby Nathan » Tue May 05, 2015 3:38 pm

I'll review from a computer later. Watching from my phone I didn't see him fire anything. Are you sure it wasn't the other officers who fired?
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Re: A video for those who think Glocks never fail

Postby Ohio9 » Tue May 05, 2015 3:57 pm

Nathan wrote:I'll review from a computer later. Watching from my phone I didn't see him fire anything. Are you sure it wasn't the other officers who fired?


Seems like he fired a few shots before his gun jammed. Also it looks clear that his slide is not out of battery before the gunfight began.

Watch the part of the video where they show it in slow motion. I can't see shell casings flying out, but I can clearly see his slide going back and forth twice before it locks back and stays there.

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Re: A video for those who think Glocks never fail

Postby Nathan » Tue May 05, 2015 4:46 pm

I hear shots while his gun is out of battery. I think they come from other officers. Will review from a computer later.
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Re: A video for those who think Glocks never fail

Postby Ohio9 » Tue May 05, 2015 5:18 pm

I just noticed that. There could be more officers there, but it still seems clear that his slide was in battery at the start of the video, meaning there was no way it became out of battery unless he fired.

Also, if you watch around 1:18, you can see his slide going back and forth a few times before it locks back.

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Re: A video for those who think Glocks never fail

Postby Nathan » Tue May 05, 2015 7:08 pm

A slide can easily be knocked out of battery when trying to shoot behind cover. Judging by his very poor form while utilizing cover it's not that much of a stretch to believe he could have knocked it out of battery. I'll be home in a little while and able to watch it on the computer.
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Re: A video for those who think Glocks never fail

Postby Pickwick » Tue May 05, 2015 7:15 pm

Glock sounds like the noise you make when you cough up a lunger...

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Re: A video for those who think Glocks never fail

Postby MisterB » Tue May 05, 2015 8:20 pm

He was taking cover behind the wall, and changed his grip and angled his wrist, and then fired. When you think about it, that might be a little like limp wristing, which may have caused the jam.

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Re: A video for those who think Glocks never fail

Postby Nathan » Tue May 05, 2015 8:42 pm

I just watched the video on my 32" monitor frame by frame in Adobe Premier. This is in no way a Glock failure. That slide is not only "out of battery", its fully locked back. This is a case of riding thumb high under stress and engaging the slide stop. A shooter failure, not a Glock failure.
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Re: A video for those who think Glocks never fail

Postby Nathan » Tue May 05, 2015 9:47 pm

...and BOOM goes the dynamite! :D
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Re: A video for those who think Glocks never fail

Postby the925life » Wed May 06, 2015 12:42 am

A quick look tells me that slide rode forward onto an empty casing that hadn't cleared the port fully, then frees up when he racks the slide. Seems like a stovepipe, but i reserve the right to revise my opinion.

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Re: A video for those who think Glocks never fail

Postby Nathan » Wed May 06, 2015 1:24 am

Slide is too far back for a stove pipe. When I get a chance I'll magnify a screen capture.
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Re: A video for those who think Glocks never fail

Postby Ohio9 » Wed May 06, 2015 9:13 am

MisterB wrote: that might be a little like limp wristing, which may have caused the jam.


Doesn't look like it to me. He seemed to have a solid two-handed grip on the gun with his arms fully extended while firing. I can't see how that could result in limp wristing.

Nathan wrote:This is a case of riding thumb high under stress and engaging the slide stop.


If that was the case, then why did we see a casing come out of the gun when he racked the slide to get it back into battery? If this was simply a case of accidentally engaging the slide stop, then there should not be a casing jammed in the gun, right?

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Re: A video for those who think Glocks never fail

Postby the925life » Wed May 06, 2015 10:31 am

Ohio9 wrote:If that was the case, then why did we see a casing come out of the gun when he racked the slide to get it back into battery? If this was simply a case of accidentally engaging the slide stop, then there should not be a casing jammed in the gun, right?


This was my point. The slide stayed rearward with an empty casing still in the chamber, or at least in the ejection port. Its possible he rode up on the slide stop lever (even though I think the video is not clear enough to prove this), contributing to the stoppage, but that's an empty casing leaving the firearm as he manipulates the slide.

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Re: A video for those who think Glocks never fail

Postby Nathan » Wed May 06, 2015 1:19 pm

Are you guys watching the same video that I'm watching? :D


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At this point he realizes the slide is locked back with the slide stop and he hits the slide release to release the slide (notice thumb posture). He then racks the slide as he is trained to do ejecting the live cartridge that was chambered when he released the slide. "Tap, rack, bang". He didn't need to "tap" because the slide wasn't stuck; it was locked. After unlocking he completed the procedure and ejected a live cartridge. It all happens in a split second so watch carefully.

This is a shooter failure.
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Re: A video for those who think Glocks never fail

Postby the925life » Wed May 06, 2015 1:46 pm

I don't think it's evident he drops the slide with the release lever, THEN racks it again.

I have the vid paused at 1:57 and it is clearly an empty casing being ejected. I'll post it up when I figure out how to get a PrintScreen converted to a decent size JPEG.

Glocks obviously suck and can't be trusted :D

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Re: A video for those who think Glocks never fail

Postby Nathan » Wed May 06, 2015 1:51 pm

I've watching it expanded and the video just isn't clear enough to positively say one way or another what the casing is. Using what we have, it is clear he releases the slide with the slide release. Look at his thumb position in the image I captured.
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Re: A video for those who think Glocks never fail

Postby Nathan » Wed May 06, 2015 1:55 pm

Slow the video down frame by frame. He releases the slide and instantly racks it.
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Re: A video for those who think Glocks never fail

Postby the925life » Wed May 06, 2015 2:50 pm

I did and I can see how his thumb position provides a basis for your argument, but with his support hand obscuring a direct view, I don't think the video is conclusive. What it does show clearly is an empty casing leaving the firearm after he racks the slide.

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Re: A video for those who think Glocks never fail

Postby Nathan » Wed May 06, 2015 3:07 pm

That is in no way a clear image. Shadowing along with poor video prevents smithing clear. Anyone know what ammo that department issues.
What is clear is his thumb position in the picture I posted. He is clearly releasing the slide stop and if you can slow the video he clearly racks the side immediately after releasing the slide release.
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Re: A video for those who think Glocks never fail

Postby samuelrp » Wed May 06, 2015 3:12 pm

:mrgreen:
Since its a G lock, we must assume operator error.
Maintain the sport. Take a kid shooting.

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Re: A video for those who think Glocks never fail

Postby Ohio9 » Wed May 06, 2015 3:34 pm

Nathan wrote: he hits the slide release to release the slide (notice thumb posture)


The fact that his thumb is in position to use the slide release is not proof that he actually used it.

Nathan wrote:The is clearly releasing the slide stop and if you can slow the video he clearly racks the side immediately after releasing the slide release.


I disagree. It seems very clear that is a casing being ejected from the gun, not a live round. Also, I don't see the slide going forward before he racks the action. I don't think he hit the slide release to send the action forward, I think he put the gun back in battery by racking it.

I know my department trains to clear jams and do emergency reloads by racking the slide, not using the slide release, because racking is easier to remember and perform under high stress. Racking is a gross motor skill, while using the slide release is a fine motor skill. I would bet that most other departments train this way as well.
Last edited by Ohio9 on Wed May 06, 2015 3:42 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: A video for those who think Glocks never fail

Postby the925life » Wed May 06, 2015 3:41 pm

Nathan wrote:Slow the video down frame by frame. He releases the slide and instantly racks it.


Can you post a screen shot of the exact moment the slide moves forward before he racks it manually? I'm not seeing it.


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